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Old 10-11-2017, 01:45 AM   #41
#1-wwf-fan
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Remember when WWE had a company they were competing with and both were packing venues like this every week?

Now WWE can't do it as the only game in town. Depressing.
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Old 10-11-2017, 01:47 AM   #42
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And ironically enough, they're relying on the guy who kayfabe bought that company 15 years ago as the headliner. Damn.
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Old 10-11-2017, 03:25 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliksuke nakamura View Post
That's actually the one I suggested (pic is it too)!
OH, no shit? I remember it looking bigger when I got dragged to a Thunder game.
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Old 10-11-2017, 04:27 AM   #44
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Those seats are actually filled with the Indian market.
This is a glorious post.
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:27 AM   #45
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Attacking them for making efforts to grow in growing markets is dumb.......
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:42 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliksuke nakamura View Post
I seriously doubt that many people bought tickets on StubHub and attempted to re-sell them.
He's saying companies will buy the tickets in hope to resell them I believe.
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:49 AM   #47
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WWE is probably in the same mindset that the the NFL especially but other sports are in

Selling tickets to events every week is icing on the cake with the cake actually being the TV deal that makes them the most money.

If WWE could computer generate a crowd into an empty building (that would react EXACTLY like they want them to mind you) theyd probably start filming every week in an empty building and do that.
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:51 AM   #48
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TV deal is good but the merchandising is where the money is. And the mark up at live shows in considerable.
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:51 AM   #49
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Well...it was. Im not sure what you pay for a shirt in 2017
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Old 10-11-2017, 11:18 AM   #50
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Its still 25 like the wweshop except WWE Shop runs deals on shirts all the time

They also dont cary 3x shirts at live shows which proves they dont know their audience
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Old 10-11-2017, 11:22 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor View Post
Attacking them for making efforts to grow in growing markets is dumb.......
Not if the way they are going about it is dumb. I could stand with my dick in the wind and say it's for China, but that doesn't mean that entire nation is going to buy my hot sauce.
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Old 10-11-2017, 11:27 PM   #52
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The effort is still,the right call, even if execution is lacking.
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Old 10-11-2017, 11:38 PM   #53
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It would be great if they could monetize all the BRIC nations and be on the cutting edge of emerging economies. But they just chose to Jinder Mahal the WWE Champion. *farting noise*
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Old 10-11-2017, 11:50 PM   #54
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True Story. Everytime I hear Jinder mentioned this is the picture in my head:



He's a big toughy.
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Old 10-12-2017, 02:25 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seph View Post
True Story. Everytime I hear Jinder mentioned this is the picture in my head:



He's a big toughy.
One of my favorite Futurama episodes ever. LOL The Gender Bender.
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Old 10-12-2017, 07:20 PM   #56
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If this is the problem at a PPV taping I imagine it might be a bigger issue at house shows.

Really I guess it depends on how reliant they are on ticket/merch sales as part of their income. Risk is reaction is to put up prices which further drives away customers, which then drives prices up further etc.

If they aren't really reliant on sales then it is less of an issue, but I remember reading that actually it's a pretty big element of revenue so could become a slightly more critical issue.

The fact they seem to be responding by reuniting the Shield and taking some steps to attract fans might show this could become more serious.

Be interesting to see if we see further cost cutting initiatives in future, such as releases or show set changes.
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Old 10-13-2017, 03:09 AM   #57
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WWE has a PROBLEM??

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Old 10-13-2017, 04:00 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outsider View Post
If this is the problem at a PPV taping I imagine it might be a bigger issue at house shows.

Really I guess it depends on how reliant they are on ticket/merch sales as part of their income. Risk is reaction is to put up prices which further drives away customers, which then drives prices up further etc.

If they aren't really reliant on sales then it is less of an issue, but I remember reading that actually it's a pretty big element of revenue so could become a slightly more critical issue.
Think they mitigated the problem by running a lot more house shows because of the new brand split era.

Although it does mean they have to deal with added costs because of more shows. Also they are currently averaging less people per house show this year and its at the worst whenever they run house shows at the same time as RAW and Smackdown airs.
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Old 10-13-2017, 05:59 PM   #59
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The sky isn't falling, but the Vince McMahon has never had a colder product.
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Old 10-13-2017, 07:34 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noid View Post
The sky isn't falling, but the Vince McMahon has never had a colder product.
Mid 90s was much worse
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Old 10-14-2017, 02:36 PM   #61
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Having a ppv every two weeks can't be helping.
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Old 10-14-2017, 03:06 PM   #62
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Do they still have ppvs?
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Old 10-14-2017, 03:06 PM   #63
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Or is it all network specials now
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Old 10-14-2017, 05:34 PM   #64
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There are some pedants that would bother to separate them.
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Old 10-14-2017, 10:16 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor View Post
Mid 90s was much worse
Was it really? I'm willing to hear worse, but "much?"
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:43 PM   #66
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They arent at risk for going belly up like they were during the hart/michaels years
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:49 PM   #67
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Mid 90s was definitely worse. The fact that they're the only game in town now and that's even a discussion though is pretty troubling.
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:51 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor View Post
They arent at risk for going belly up like they were during the hart/michaels years
That's true. I think they're in a better position, but I think engagement with the product is very low. Comparable, at the very least.
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:53 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Mid 90s was definitely worse. The fact that they're the only game in town now and that's even a discussion though is pretty troubling.
If Vince had competition, Reigns turns heel after the 2015 Royal Rumble and gets humble-fucked by Brock at WrestleMania 31. Reigns is then really cool as a heel, gets cheered and probably wins the belt at Mania the next year to a massive pop and wrestling is cool again. But Vince gets to dictate this narrative.
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:54 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #1-wwf-fan View Post
Mid 90s was definitely worse. The fact that they're the only game in town now and that's even a discussion though is pretty troubling.
I think hey have competition. NJPW amd the Indies thanks to internet a more available than ever. Die hard wresling fans in the past would have suffered tthrouh a poor product onstead of not watching anything at all.

Now they lave reasonable ways to watch what they want. Its a different market is all.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:15 PM   #71
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I think you're technically correct, Destor, but I don't feel that there's any real loss of market for the WWE, which is why they haven't just smooshed these guys earlier. And I'm not sure if any of them are dudes who don't also religiously watch WWE too. I think the "popularity" of the independents is vastly overblown by people who are trying to help it get perceived as such.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:20 PM   #72
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It's still WWE #1 in the sense that there is one big league and a whole bunch of little leagues. It will take a star to challenge that perception. If The Rock, for example, started his own promotion, everyone would be like "Oh, that is the new main wrestling." Then WWE would be forced to change and New Japan and all the indies would be the auxiliaries to that.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:21 PM   #73
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Im not claiming theyre about to be overtaken but i would wager that if you didnt have rhe varies alternatives in place youd have a 3.5 every monday.

Wrestling fans will watch bad wrestling if its the only wrestling available to them.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:22 PM   #74
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People will eat shit if theyre hungry enough
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:22 PM   #75
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I just had a thought. It might be a really dumb and dangerous idea, but imagine if New Japan branded themselves "the biggest wrestling promotion in the world," on the basis that WWE doesn't consider itself wrestling? Vince has always taken the "I don't consider UFC competition" (even though it is basically wrestling). Imagine if someone no-sold him as competition.

It would make me chuckle, at the very least. And that should be the goal of any expanding business.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:23 PM   #76
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MMA is def competition
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:25 PM   #77
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The only thing New Japan needs to do is increase visibility of the app and performance of the app. The people who wan that product will gravitate.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:28 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor View Post
Im not claiming theyre about to be overtaken but i would wager that if you didnt have rhe varies alternatives in place youd have a 3.5 every monday.

Wrestling fans will watch bad wrestling if its the only wrestling available to them.
Okay, I completely agree with your "people will eat shit if they are hungry enough" line. I maintain that is what is happening now though. If there were another wrestling show on at the same time, I think the WWE is very beatable. I mean, it takes a while for a "brand" to get recognition, etc. TNA tried in 2010 and failed pretty miserably. There is brand loyalty, familiarity, habit and all that sort of stuff to fight against too. But if I had the direct choice between "WWE" and "not WWE," I am choosing "not WWE."

I'm not sure if the people that dropped away from that 3.5 number are watching indies, basically. That is where we disagree. I think the people who are watching indies also just so happen to catch a tiny bit of RAW each week. Of course, this is just hypothesizing -- I've got no way of knowing this. WWE is not priority programming anymore though, and if you got the people who still watched to understand that there is something else on the other channel -- not so much that you need to sign up to this internet thing and get out the credit card, etc. -- things would be very different.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:30 PM   #79
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Quote:
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The only thing New Japan needs to do is increase visibility of the app and performance of the app. The people who wan that product will gravitate.
Yeah, you are right on that. I'm just stuck on television like it's not a dying platform.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:30 PM   #80
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I def think there is .8 worth a fans that are getting their fix elsewhere
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