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View Poll Results: Who is the better wrestler? | |||
John Cena | 11 | 37.93% | |
Andre The Giant | 18 | 62.07% | |
Voters: 29. You must log in or register to vote on this poll. |
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Thread Tools | Display Modes |
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06-30-2017, 03:19 PM | #1 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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Better Wrestler #64
VS 3 DAYS |
06-30-2017, 03:20 PM | #2 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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By popular demand
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06-30-2017, 03:22 PM | #3 |
MVP Mark
Posts: 16,447
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Cena. Andre is 100 percent a legend and a beast but Cena is still a Rushmore wrestler.
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06-30-2017, 03:50 PM | #4 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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06-30-2017, 06:36 PM | #5 |
MVP Mark
Posts: 16,447
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06-30-2017, 03:22 PM | #6 |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Andre because he's Andre.
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06-30-2017, 03:23 PM | #7 |
Resident drug enabler
Posts: 45,473
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Gooooodddammit. Gotta think on this one.
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06-30-2017, 04:05 PM | #8 |
Posts: 60,919
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Andre the Giant is overlooked by many simply as a big man. His work was genius. His work as Monster Roussimoff was athletic and savvy. The dude legitimately drew, and in my opinion, is far more recognizable than John Cena. Everybody has heard of Andre the Giant. His presence on the Obey t-shirts lends him more contemporary cultural significance than Cena.
Plus, Andre was in The Princess Bride. That's a more prominent contribution to cinematography than anything Cena has ever done. Monster Roussimoff (aka Andre the Giant) vs... by 25COOLPIN17 |
06-30-2017, 05:25 PM | #9 | |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Quote:
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06-30-2017, 04:31 PM | #10 |
Resident drug enabler
Posts: 45,473
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I always try to factor in the era/booking in order to judge the wrestler himself more fairly in these things. Cena is fucking great and would have been an even bigger star in any other era. That being said, I still don't think I can put him over Andre.
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06-30-2017, 04:36 PM | #11 |
His name is Jeff Harvey
Posts: 5,256
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My vote is probably biased since I was born in the early 90's but Cena easily based on how much more he entertained me than Andre. I've seen some of Andre's older work and it was fun. I get that Andre is probably as popular as Hogan and Cena is a tier below that. But I'd much rather watch Cena than Andre in a wrestling show. I always wonder how much of a pop culture icon The Big Show could've been if he had been presented like the larger than life Andre.
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06-30-2017, 05:10 PM | #12 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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I will abstain for now. Noid has me leaning Andre. Will wait to see if anyone can push me the otherway.
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06-30-2017, 05:34 PM | #13 |
Posts: 60,919
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Thanks. I think "Andre for being Andre" kind of captures it too.
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06-30-2017, 06:40 PM | #14 |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Surely Andre before Cena. Cena is cool and all but he ain't touching a wrestling Mount Rushmore.
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06-30-2017, 06:42 PM | #15 |
MVP Mark
Posts: 16,447
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The man who carried the company for a decade while transitioning into a PG era isn't on there?
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06-30-2017, 06:48 PM | #16 | |
Posts: 60,919
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Andre helped put wrestling on the map. He's a legitimate cultural figure. I was watching an episode of QI recently where Stephen Fry was talking about his significance. Andre's not just some obscure big guy who worked with Hogan -- he helped fill up buildings and helped create a myth around pro-wrestling that allowed Hogan and Vince to springboard the Rock 'n' Wrestling movement. He wasn't just a pushed guy, regardless of how talented and hard working that pushed guy is. Cena doesn't top Flair for an American wrestling Mt. Rushmore. Dave Meltzer makes the case that Triple H drew more money for the WWE in the 2000-2010 period than Cena actually did, which is a sad state of affairs, given that Triple H was a negligible factor when working with The Rock during their hottest year. |
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06-30-2017, 06:54 PM | #17 | |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Pretty much. |
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06-30-2017, 06:57 PM | #18 | |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Andre the Giant is a historical figure. John Cena is kind of just well... John Cena. |
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06-30-2017, 06:43 PM | #19 |
Posts: 60,919
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Who are the four biggest stars in American wrestling history? You'd surely have to put Hogan, Rock and Austin up the first names that come to mind, but after that you're probably looking at Andre, really. Or...Flair?
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06-30-2017, 06:45 PM | #20 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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Flair wayyyyyyy before Rock
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06-30-2017, 06:46 PM | #21 |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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4 year career, cmon. Hot 4 years...but doesnt touch Flair
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06-30-2017, 06:49 PM | #22 |
Posts: 60,919
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06-30-2017, 07:38 PM | #23 |
Rigged from the start
Posts: 35,417
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But as of right now, for me personally, anyway, Rock still makes it, but I digress.
As to the poll itself, you've got a guy with 16 world titles to tie Flair, with one which lasted a bit over a year, and on the other side you've got a truly iconic figure from wrestling's past who went 15 years undefeated, had a long and storied rivalry with Hogan and was the inspiration/template for The Giant/Big Show. André in a landslide for me. |
06-30-2017, 06:51 PM | #24 |
Posts: 60,919
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These conversations always get dragged into modernity too. Should there be a Frank Gotch, George Hackenschmidt or Strangler Lewis up there?
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06-30-2017, 06:56 PM | #25 |
Resident drug enabler
Posts: 45,473
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06-30-2017, 07:04 PM | #26 |
Posts: 60,919
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The WWE ran off their audience in order to jam Cena in, and now their current audience depends on Cena.
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06-30-2017, 07:07 PM | #27 |
Reigning Tipsters Champ!
Posts: 2,087
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Cena is great, but he is also overrated. Seems the internet completely 180'ed on him over his US title reign but he was absolute muck for a LOT of that preceding decade.
Sure he suffered from PG and repetitive booking, and yeah, he is funny, can talk and has great matches with the right opponents, but he still has spent long periods with an extremely stale character, had some horrendously boring feuds and not really evolved a whole lot as a personality in a time of ratings decline and a lack of competition for the top spot in the company. He is great, but he is Warrior, Hitman, even Macho Man great in my opinion. I love them all...but they are not that upper echelon. Cena was never close to Austin, Hogan, Rock in terms of sheer star power. Andre was close...very close, if not there already. Not only does he have global appeal, but he was a massive draw and THE guy that handed the torch over to Hulk Hogan himself. He was tremendously respected by his peers and cherished by Vince Sr. He was unique, larger than life and, like Noida said, he could wrestle too! Cena is great, he is an 8,5 out of 10 guy for me in the history of the business, but Andre is a 9 for me as an overall package, just under the very best. |
06-30-2017, 07:35 PM | #28 |
Posts: 60,919
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The US Title reign did a lot of for perceptions of Cena, but the Brock squash was cathartic too.
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06-30-2017, 07:53 PM | #29 |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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lol inspiration/template for the big show. Way to go Gooby.
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06-30-2017, 08:06 PM | #30 |
I'm Something Else
Posts: 1,684
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Had to go with the 8th Wonder of the world.
Cena has been the flag bearer for WWE a good 11 years now. But for all he has done, he just doesn't come close. Andre had a mystique about him, he was just an awesome presence in the ring. And Without that historical moment of Hogan Slamming him at Wrestlemania 3, WWE might have never really peaked. People still talk about that moment even today. |
06-30-2017, 08:22 PM | #31 |
Loque Ja
Posts: 87,868
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To me, this is pretty much John Cena vs. Brock Lesnar again.
It comes down to a guy who is a "total package" in and out of the ring vs. a guy whose "mystique" and "aura" was off the charts. I voted John Cena over Brock Lesnar, and I'm going to have to do the same with Andre. A lot of the time I ask myself if I were running a wrestling company, who would I want on my roster. I'd think about it a bit, and then I'd choose John Cena. |
06-30-2017, 08:24 PM | #32 |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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lol I would not want John Cena (at least how he's been written and presented) in my main event, even though I respect him. Maybe presented as someone/something else I'd be down with him but I can only see what's been given to me.
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06-30-2017, 08:26 PM | #33 |
3 Dicks Out For Trips
Posts: 29,658
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I would put Cena on my Mt Rushmore. Andre wouldn't make the cut. Andres peak imo was when he was basically playing second fiddle to Hogan. Cena IS this eras Hogan or SCSA. He is the top dog and has been for over a decade now.
Plus, as blasphemous as it is to say this, Andre never really did it for me. |
06-30-2017, 08:28 PM | #34 | |
I am the cheese
Posts: 51,037
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06-30-2017, 08:37 PM | #35 | |
3 Dicks Out For Trips
Posts: 29,658
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I often wonder how well Cena would have drawn in the attitude Era when he wouldn't have been held back or dumbed down. And even though it is pure conjecture....I think he would have legit been the biggest thing in wrestling history. He can pull groups of people in that none of the others could have. Young people would have flocked to him. He would have run circles around everyone other than the rock promo wise. He was better in ring than SCSA or The Rock or HHH. He is a legit total package, a true star, and he has been held back to protect Linda McMahon political career. |
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06-30-2017, 09:06 PM | #36 | ||
Posts: 60,919
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I completely disagree with the sentiment about him being better in the ring than all of those guys except Triple H. Austin and Rock were magnetic and fantastic at holding fans' interests. Promo-wise? Cena can talk alright, but I'm not sure he doesn't get smoked by the authentic bad-assery of Austin and Rock. Some of Cena's promos actually manage to miss the point of themselves too. He's not a god on the mic. Some of his stuff stinks. Some is excellent. Honestly, I'm not sure he makes it past mid-card in the Attitude era. |
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06-30-2017, 08:29 PM | #37 |
3 Dicks Out For Trips
Posts: 29,658
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Also when you are booked to go undefeated for 15 years you pretty much automatically become a legend. A legend because that's what the booker wanted you to be. Goldberg went undefeated for like a year and a half and look how that made him a star even though in reality he is balls.
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06-30-2017, 08:39 PM | #38 |
boop/bop/beep
Posts: 38,427
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Linda McMahon's political career has nothing to do with it. You can do PG and make it good. It's just bad booking, and in some cases, poor execution from Cena. He's a hell of a talent but IMO would have gotten chewed up in the shark tank during the attitude era.
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06-30-2017, 08:58 PM | #39 | |
3 Dicks Out For Trips
Posts: 29,658
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That's why people drifted away from the PG era. Older fans experienced what wrestling used to be and saw a superior product. Them you take away the edginess of it. The you never know what will happen aspect is gone. Suddenly guys who came off as believable during promos are spouting childish nonsense and have to be involved in increasingly stupid feuds. Moves that were staples of wrestling suddenly get banned because omg someone might get hurt. We can't show this stuff to children! Why not, you always have? So bye bye adult crowd. And I don't know about you, but even when I was a kid, I was drawn to wrestling because it was fantastically violent and unhinged and kind of taboo in a way. I wasn't allowed to say or do this stuff, so it was an amazing outlet. With this PG era, you don't draw as many kids. You know why? Because they can still get those same kind of kicks from other avenues of entertainment that aren't concerned with dumbing down their product for appearance and to help someone in a floundering political career. There are some things that go out the door with PG. They lost their ability to be believable. They aren't going to get it back until they remove the safety. It's like a good violent action movie, like John Wick. Make a PG version of it and I bet you it flops. Because it won't be believable and the actors will have scripts that make them sound like idiotic teenagers being overdramatic. |
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07-01-2017, 12:21 AM | #40 |
Rigged from the start
Posts: 35,417
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And meanwhile, let's all put on our blinders and our rose-colored glasses and pretend Benoit never happened. I'm sorry, dude, I love you as a poster, but you're absolutely out of your fucking mind if you seriously think what happened surrounding him 10 years ago now wasn't the original catalyst for WWE going PG in 2008. Did Linda's political aspirations have some small factor? I'm sure they did, but not nearly as much as you'd have us believe.
Just sayin'. |